Posted By Snipehunter at 08:48 AM - Wed May 16 2018

Posted By markof at

• can the otterbears be replaced by a rowboat ?
• can we towe the barge behind 4 otterbears for increased speed ?
• can we drag the barge on skis or logs to move it on ground ?

Rowboat? Eh... that seems unlikely. Can the barge be towed in general though? Yes!

4 Otterbear team? Interesting, at the moment we have not created a way to hitch the yokes together like that, but I can't really rule it out, either.

Amphibarges? Portage? You folks will have to do some research here, I'm thinking.

Hope that helps! :)

You just haven't lived until you have put two ship's boats over the side with a dozen sailing cadets in each and then tried to pull your 3 masted barquentine.

Rowboats can pull ships, indeed if there is no wind it is the only way to get anywhere (but getting tired is 100% a thing!).
A boat off each bow works well, after all there is no hand brake on a sailing ship either, although the sails can be used for that.

Note that these are proper rowing boats - there is nearly no cargo space, and no mast. They are rowing out a Brixham trawler.

What will not work is trying to row a barge upriver against a strong current when you don't have a lot of rowers. And the dainty sailing dingy would be able to have 4 oars at most ... not remotely enough.

Just need a galley with 3 decks of oars.

Ultimate Aussie lifestyle - boat-home confirmed :-D

Fishing form your living room. Inviting friends for a sundowner :-) while your otter-bears pull your home along the river/shore.

The next question begging, then, is whether rivers will ever be strong-flowing enough to make upstream barge towing uneconomical.

Based on previous posts on the use of simplified hydrological models, my guess is that rivers will be rather staid, for the most part. There may be areas with cataracts and rapids, which are non-navigable by definition. Stretches with strong flows will be places where the river narrows and does not deepen sufficiently to maintain a cross-sectional area comparable to the placid stretches.

I don't suppose canals or locks will be available to get around the difficult stretches. Perhaps with enough traffic these points will give rise to settlements specializing in portage services.

@Drun Redforge I'm sorry, you are right i interpreted your post as hostile and that is why i have not thanked you as i thanked Snipehunter.

It is also right that you extended the reflection beyond the otterbarge to all towed vehicles. And i should thank you for that and for the fact that your post forced my to research the things i knew existed and in the process learned a few more.

I should not have jumped the gun and so i apology for that.

@Poldano We know that unfortunately terraforming will not be:( and especially in regard to water, so canals and lock will probably not be a thing. But it seems safe to assume that rivers might not be calm stream and that rapids and cataracts exist, breaking navigability.

i'd love to see locks but i think that we have more chances to see, after we research them, things like The Diolkos or some boat lift or crane, some epic buildings around which a barony or a town would be perfect.

Posted By markof at 10:47 AM - Thu May 17 2018

@Drun Redforge I'm sorry, you are right i interpreted your post as hostile and that is why i have not thanked you as i thanked Snipehunter.

It is also right that you extended the reflection beyond the otterbarge to all towed vehicles. And i should thank you for that and for the fact that your post forced my to research the things i knew existed and in the process learned a few more.

I should not have jumped the gun and so i apology for that.

@Poldano We know that unfortunately terraforming will not be:( and especially in regard to water, so canals and lock will probably not be a thing. But it seems safe to assume that rivers might not be calm stream and that rapids and cataracts exist, breaking navigability.

i'd love to see locks but i think that we have more chances to see, after we research them, things like The Diolkos or some boat lift or crane, some epic buildings around which a barony or a town would be perfect.

I'm planning to do exactly that sort of thing. Connecting a land trade route with a river trade route.

Posted By zimmah at 04:45 AM - Thu May 17 2018

Just need a galley with 3 decks of oars.

Need to invent galley, then biremes, then triremes first? :)

Posted By Snipehunter at 04:05 AM - Thu May 17 2018

Yeah, to be clear, I was saying that it's unlikely the tiny little boat that is the rowboat being sold in this promotion could tow much of anything effectively. The barge is towable, however.

<3

Would we need to invent better rope making techniques to pull it with anything other than a couple of mounts? You can have as many oxen or otterbears as you want, if you don't have strong enough rope it will just snap under the load.

Rope making has been around for a very long time, but I can't see it being a very sexy profession for players at launch - and certainly not with rope walks of the size that could make the ropes for very large ships.

But post launch ... ?

Posted By markof at

One can assume that the same need will produce the same development along rivers, barging inns, where one could either change their otterbears for an other pair or rest in style and security.

Forget along the rivers, IN the rivers, and I now want a floating Inn with otterbear stables... just remember; Nothing's free in Waterworld.

Posted By Orisoll at 10:59 AM - Tue May 15 2018

Why not just bring the otterbears aboard to rest?

Depends on the weight the barge can support lol. Otterbears are probably very heavy, and you got two of them!

@Markof,

Thanks for the info about the Diolkos. I didn't know about it before. The concept, to a modern person, is obvious. Not so obvious is that some clever means will need to be devised to keep boats from breaking while being transported. This was alluded to in the Wikipedia article, and is something for carpenter/shipwrights to work on when such a project becomes economically feasible.

Posted By Lady Grace at 07:56 AM - Thu May 17 2018

Would we need to invent better rope making techniques to pull it with anything other than a couple of mounts? You can have as many oxen or otterbears as you want, if you don't have strong enough rope it will just snap under the load.

Rope making has been around for a very long time, but I can't see it being a very sexy profession for players at launch - and certainly not with rope walks of the size that could make the ropes for very large ships.

But post launch ... ?

The Greek city Sparta has been interpreted as meaning "rope". Gene Wolfe's main character in his "Soldier" series refers to Sparta as "Rope" and Spartans as "Ropemakers". Perhaps the possibility of a relation to Sparta will inspire prospective ropemakers.

On the other hand, perhaps the reason that the Spartans enslaved other local Greeks and made them do all the work was because ropemaking sucked.

Invest in technology and research.... get a steam engine for paddle-steamers and trains and we can retire most of the animals to recreation and pet food ;)